Mary Stayed Out All Night, Some Thoughts
Dec. 16th, 2010 04:47 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
walkwithheroesWe've more than reached the half-way mark for this show (episodes 10-12 aired this week), and I think it's time to share some thoughts. The writer change was a good idea; you can tell the new writer is trying to get all the storylines together and trying to turn even the most hated characters (the parents) into real people. JI has become an interesting and real boy! Joon is still. . .a diva, but at least we've gotten a small reason why. And MG/MR? Are awesome and adorable.
The written preview is out at Ockoala. Ockoala says its a bit makjang, but I saw differently. Why? Well,
Think back. No, seriously, look at Hana Kimi, Playful Kiss, Goong, Hana Yori Dango, Personal Taste, 1 Pound no Fukuin, Absolute Boyfriend, Oh, My Lady, Take Care of the Young Lady, most Hong sister dramas - I could go on. None of them, if you really think about it, have plots that make sense. Like, at all.
Hana Kimi - I keep up with high school athletics in Japan. The boy who once saved me is on the track team. I know! I'll pretend to be a boy, go to his school, and try to get him to jump again! Perfect plan. (Makes no sense!)
Playful Kiss - I'll stalk you, 'til you love me. In any other drama, she's be Creepy from Gloria.
Goong - You're both teenagers, but you'll marry because of a promise between two dead men. Even though he has a girlfriend and we know nothing about her.
Hana Yori Dango - The crazy, destructive, boy who rules the school will fall for you, if you punch him - once.
Full House - You can't legally sell someone else's house!
I could go on. . .
Look, I'm not saying Mary Stayed Out All Night is the best written show ever. It's clearly not. It has a lot of plot holes (How can MR/MG have been a fake couple for 50+ days when they met in early November, and episode 8 took place on November 30th?) and the original plot doesn't make all that much sense. The Dads and Mom are unlikeable, Joon is underdeveloped (I blame it on her being an original character for the drama, used as a plot deceive by the first writer, and deemed useless by the second writer), and most of the goodness of the drama comes solely from the interactions between MG/MR/JI.
But, the doesn't make it a terrible drama that's lost its mind. It barely had a mind to begin with! Mary's always been, what it is, a romantic comedy that's just a little bit cracky. At least the new writer has stopped using the same few plots over and over again (Loser Dad tries to break up MG/MR, Creepy Dad tries to force JI/MR together, Joon throws a diva fit, Loser Mom visits MG and then leaves him to go see her boyfriend, MG/MR are cute together, a misunderstanding, its all resolved, JI looks at MR, MG/MR are cute.)
At least this writer is trying to evolve the characters a bit: the past between the parents, Joon, JI as a person, that's all being explored. I like that. The pace has picked up, JI is a real person, and the writer is trying to explain why Creepy Dad is creepy and why Loser Mom is always abandoning MG. It may not always make the most sense, but at least she's trying to turn these previously unlikeable or wooden characters into real people.
JI is learning that his father is in love with MR's mother. I think he's starting to realize why his dad wants him to marry MR. That's why he'll start treating her coldly in episode 13. He doesn't want her to suffer under his Creepy-ass father. (Who is seriously two steps from being cartoonishly evil)
JI moves MG into his house, so the two (MR/MG) can be together without Loser Dad stalking them every five seconds. JI may have feelings for MR, but he also wants her to be happy.
Loser Dad and Creepy Dad need to wake up - MR doesn't want JI. Maybe if they had calmly asked them to date a few months ago, things would be different. But, now it's too late. Loser Dad just wants his debts paid; Creepy Dad just wants to live the marriage he never had with MR's mother via JI and MR. It's gross.
Loser Mom telling MG she wishes she had never had him? It's nothing that can't be forgiven so easily.
Joon - its a bit late for her to be a real character. But, her pity party has stopped for the moment. Yes, she's had a few fits, but at least the new writer is trying to make her a more likable and real character.
JI - he's become a real person. Likable. His feelings for MR seem more real now, and though I still think they aren't right for each other (MR would have to change too much, deal with Creepy Dad; JI seems to see MR as "save" - almost like a mother or sister), I still think they make good friends.
MR/MG - they are one of the cutest couples of the year. I really think this show is about MG growing up and growing as a person. MR is his way of growing up. Their love is what is helping MG become an adult. I like that.
In short, Mary isn't a great series. But, it's a good romantic comedy. And, just like all romantic comedies (especially those based off mangas or manhwa, a lot of the plot is out there. Mary doesn't take place in the ground world. It couldn't. It shouldn't. It takes place in manhwa world; where princes marry commoners, movie stars marry internet writers, and no one can tell a girl is a girl when she wears a boy's uniform.
Am I disappointed in the drama? A little bit, yeah. It could have gone a lot of places, but it didn't. Then again, neither does the on-line manhwa. I suppose this drama could have been better if they had stayed closer to the original source materiel, but that would have made a better daily drama. And, I doubt JGS and MGY (who make this drama) would do a daily drama.
I think what makes me sad is that people are starting to say Mary is "so bad its good" and that it "has no point". Come on, it's not a heavy drama! It hasn't made sense since day one! Two contract marriages. Creepy Dad. (And, why doesn't Creepy Dad just have MG arrested? Legally, he and MR are having an affair, and that's illegal in Korea.) The wackiness. Etc. None of it has ever made sense. But, now you turn your back on it? Just as the pace is moving forward and characters are developing. I just. . .it annoys me when people are drama snobs over a breezy romantic comedy.
I'm not angry at anyone. It just makes me sad when people watch a show for 12 episodes, then decide it's a bad drama. Just as the writer is fixing things and making things slowly start to make sense.
Or maybe its me. Maybe I love this series, MG/MR, etc, so much that I'm ignoring the bad in favor of the loveliness of MG/MR. I don't know, but I just had to get this out.
The written preview is out at Ockoala. Ockoala says its a bit makjang, but I saw differently. Why? Well,
Think back. No, seriously, look at Hana Kimi, Playful Kiss, Goong, Hana Yori Dango, Personal Taste, 1 Pound no Fukuin, Absolute Boyfriend, Oh, My Lady, Take Care of the Young Lady, most Hong sister dramas - I could go on. None of them, if you really think about it, have plots that make sense. Like, at all.
Hana Kimi - I keep up with high school athletics in Japan. The boy who once saved me is on the track team. I know! I'll pretend to be a boy, go to his school, and try to get him to jump again! Perfect plan. (Makes no sense!)
Playful Kiss - I'll stalk you, 'til you love me. In any other drama, she's be Creepy from Gloria.
Goong - You're both teenagers, but you'll marry because of a promise between two dead men. Even though he has a girlfriend and we know nothing about her.
Hana Yori Dango - The crazy, destructive, boy who rules the school will fall for you, if you punch him - once.
Full House - You can't legally sell someone else's house!
I could go on. . .
Look, I'm not saying Mary Stayed Out All Night is the best written show ever. It's clearly not. It has a lot of plot holes (How can MR/MG have been a fake couple for 50+ days when they met in early November, and episode 8 took place on November 30th?) and the original plot doesn't make all that much sense. The Dads and Mom are unlikeable, Joon is underdeveloped (I blame it on her being an original character for the drama, used as a plot deceive by the first writer, and deemed useless by the second writer), and most of the goodness of the drama comes solely from the interactions between MG/MR/JI.
But, the doesn't make it a terrible drama that's lost its mind. It barely had a mind to begin with! Mary's always been, what it is, a romantic comedy that's just a little bit cracky. At least the new writer has stopped using the same few plots over and over again (Loser Dad tries to break up MG/MR, Creepy Dad tries to force JI/MR together, Joon throws a diva fit, Loser Mom visits MG and then leaves him to go see her boyfriend, MG/MR are cute together, a misunderstanding, its all resolved, JI looks at MR, MG/MR are cute.)
At least this writer is trying to evolve the characters a bit: the past between the parents, Joon, JI as a person, that's all being explored. I like that. The pace has picked up, JI is a real person, and the writer is trying to explain why Creepy Dad is creepy and why Loser Mom is always abandoning MG. It may not always make the most sense, but at least she's trying to turn these previously unlikeable or wooden characters into real people.
JI is learning that his father is in love with MR's mother. I think he's starting to realize why his dad wants him to marry MR. That's why he'll start treating her coldly in episode 13. He doesn't want her to suffer under his Creepy-ass father. (Who is seriously two steps from being cartoonishly evil)
JI moves MG into his house, so the two (MR/MG) can be together without Loser Dad stalking them every five seconds. JI may have feelings for MR, but he also wants her to be happy.
Loser Dad and Creepy Dad need to wake up - MR doesn't want JI. Maybe if they had calmly asked them to date a few months ago, things would be different. But, now it's too late. Loser Dad just wants his debts paid; Creepy Dad just wants to live the marriage he never had with MR's mother via JI and MR. It's gross.
Loser Mom telling MG she wishes she had never had him? It's nothing that can't be forgiven so easily.
Joon - its a bit late for her to be a real character. But, her pity party has stopped for the moment. Yes, she's had a few fits, but at least the new writer is trying to make her a more likable and real character.
JI - he's become a real person. Likable. His feelings for MR seem more real now, and though I still think they aren't right for each other (MR would have to change too much, deal with Creepy Dad; JI seems to see MR as "save" - almost like a mother or sister), I still think they make good friends.
MR/MG - they are one of the cutest couples of the year. I really think this show is about MG growing up and growing as a person. MR is his way of growing up. Their love is what is helping MG become an adult. I like that.
In short, Mary isn't a great series. But, it's a good romantic comedy. And, just like all romantic comedies (especially those based off mangas or manhwa, a lot of the plot is out there. Mary doesn't take place in the ground world. It couldn't. It shouldn't. It takes place in manhwa world; where princes marry commoners, movie stars marry internet writers, and no one can tell a girl is a girl when she wears a boy's uniform.
Am I disappointed in the drama? A little bit, yeah. It could have gone a lot of places, but it didn't. Then again, neither does the on-line manhwa. I suppose this drama could have been better if they had stayed closer to the original source materiel, but that would have made a better daily drama. And, I doubt JGS and MGY (who make this drama) would do a daily drama.
I think what makes me sad is that people are starting to say Mary is "so bad its good" and that it "has no point". Come on, it's not a heavy drama! It hasn't made sense since day one! Two contract marriages. Creepy Dad. (And, why doesn't Creepy Dad just have MG arrested? Legally, he and MR are having an affair, and that's illegal in Korea.) The wackiness. Etc. None of it has ever made sense. But, now you turn your back on it? Just as the pace is moving forward and characters are developing. I just. . .it annoys me when people are drama snobs over a breezy romantic comedy.
I'm not angry at anyone. It just makes me sad when people watch a show for 12 episodes, then decide it's a bad drama. Just as the writer is fixing things and making things slowly start to make sense.
Or maybe its me. Maybe I love this series, MG/MR, etc, so much that I'm ignoring the bad in favor of the loveliness of MG/MR. I don't know, but I just had to get this out.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2010-12-16 11:04 pm (UTC)A lot of the dramas you listed as having similarly insane plots are dramas I can't stand (Hana Kimi, etc) but a few that I do love - Goong, ISWAK and Hanadan incarnations are different from MSOAN is that no matter how bizarre the original set-up (and I don't even think Goong's set-up is that odd in a culture that still considers arranged marriages acceptable), the reason it works is because despite the crazy situation (a) the characters feel real and, more importantly (b) the situation is dealt with gradually and with all its ramifications addressed.
It's not just the set-up is bizarre - set-up of most kdramas are bizarre - it's the way it's addressed - the plot jumps around for no reason and character development doesn't really work. If you take e.g. Meteor Garden, the reason it works for me is because it shows what would happen if you took such a crazy set-up and worked through all its permutations - I like the gradual character change and the fact that it takes DMS jumping through 12 loops of hell to get into her good graces (I agree Hanadan jdrama and especially BOF skip through a lot of that but that is why I like them less than the Taiwanese version or the manga). Or Goong - it takes the set-up and then shows what would happen.
A lot of it is in the execution. Dramas, good dramas, are realistic, at least emotionally, not because the situations are realistic (is Giant realistic? Or Secret Garden, with its body swap? Chuno, maybe, in a heightened realism sort of way) but because characters caught in them are and the way they deal with the crazy situation is realistic. Mary is not that way. None of the main three (let alone the rest) react in any way a human would react, by now.
I don't think Mary is a good romantic comedy (obviously a personal opinion). My Girl is a good romantic comedy. Secret Garden is a good romantic comedy. Goong is a good romantic comedy - they all have solid writing, gradual character development, and I find watching most of each episode fun. In Mary, I only ever wanted to watch the OTP scenes, the rest bored me to death and still do. When at least half the running time is a waste, for me, that's not a good kdrama.
The craziness also mitigates my emotional investment. These feel like manga puppets, not real people (even M&M to a degree, but certainly the rest). I cried so hard I could barely see when the break-up in e.g. My Girl occurred. Here, I am not as emotionally invested because none of it feels emotionally real. It feels like what it is - a live-action version of a manga. But really good dramas transcend that and make it real - you need different things from a live action than you do from shoujo drama. Or at least I do.
I don't mean to bash MSOAN. I enjoy it. Certainly much more than I did something like Oh My Lady (lack of any story or chemistry) or Take Care of the Lady (where I hated the heroine with a passion). I think Personal Taste is a great comparison actually - wonderful OTP with amazing chemistry but the rest of the drama a waste of my time and the writing hampering the OTP rather than helping it.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 02:34 am (UTC)Other than that, your thoughts are really well thought out. Thanks for sharing them.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-19 08:45 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-19 08:48 pm (UTC)Oh wait, you may not have been speaking to me. Never mind.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-16 11:34 pm (UTC)lol, so true XD
Haven't watched the latest episodes, but it's not bad. I'll be excited to see JI turn into a real person :)
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 02:36 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-16 11:46 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 12:07 am (UTC)I usually like dramas about the same from beginning to end (YAB being an exception). I thought MSOAN was cracky, entertaining as hell, with great OTP chemistry and with the depth of a puddle and I still think that. I mean - if people think it just went down the slippery slope to delicious insanity now, I am not sure what they were watching. If you want an emotionally profound drama with things to say about the world, go watch Chuno or Mawang, not a drama about a girl in two contract marriages at the same time.
ETA: I don't think people are turning on it. Dramabeans and her commenters are having a hatefest but they disliked it from the start so it's not really a change in attitude.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 12:28 am (UTC)If you want an emotionally profound drama with things to say about the world
THIS REMINDS ME. Mousie, if I haven't restarted STS by the new year, remind me to get on it.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 12:41 am (UTC)You should totally catch up on Secret Garden though.
THIS REMINDS ME. Mousie, if I haven't restarted STS by the new year, remind me to get on it.
Gladly.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 02:43 am (UTC)I did do a Mary video, if you want to watch it - feel free. Hope you like it.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:53 am (UTC)Off to watch your vid!
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 04:01 am (UTC)I hope you like the video. I look forward to your thoughts.
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Date: 2010-12-17 04:23 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 04:09 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 04:23 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 02:42 am (UTC)ETA: I don't think people are turning on it. Dramabeans and her commenters are having a hatefest but they disliked it from the start so it's not really a change in attitude.
I think my rant comes from Dramabeans, Soompi, and a few other people. It makes me, annoyed isn't the right word, but it's like this: everyone is entitled to their own opinions. But, it annoys me when people go onto forums or write long journal entries about how much they hate a certain drama. It's one of the reasons why anti-fans annoy me. Why spend so much time on something you supposedly hate? It's cool if you post about how disappointed you are with certain things, but - do you have to take up pages of a thread or tons of space on my f-list to tell me how much you hate a drama?
Also - I don't think I want to go to Soompi anymore, especially the Gloria thread. People are starting to hate on that drama, too.
Oh, I finally did a mary fanvid - its a bit below. Hope you like it.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 02:50 am (UTC)I saw Gloria bashing and it made me :( WTF.
I don't go to M3 thread because it's JI/MR central and that makes no sense to me.
I keep expecting Secret Garden to devolve into bashing any moment - we just passed the halfway mark.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:09 am (UTC)I still don't get JI/MR. Even with the new writer, with JI acting like a real person - I'm just getting brother/sister vibes. Maybe its just too late for me to switch.
I've seen a little bit of Secret Garden bashing on my f-list. Mostly concern that the plot isn't really going anywhere. I can't comment on that, as I still haven't started it. I'm waiting until the end - then I'll check the f-list to see if people think its still worth a go. If there's one thing i hate: it's a well written, well directed, well acted drama that goes nowhere.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:19 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:28 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 02:37 am (UTC)That's very true. I had forgotten about that. I remember the backlash of You're Beautiful and Cinderella's Unni, It doesn't make sense to me: the way people bitch about dramas. You don't like it, don't watch it. Just say; "I'm dropping this." and move on.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 02:54 am (UTC)This said, I rarely post repeated rants. YAB is probably the only exception because I just couldn't understand how everyone was loving it and was also pissed at all the bashing of IRIS just because it was winning the ratings battle (I would have been indifferent to YAB but insane fandom pushed me over to hate). It kept bugging me, hence the posting. But I did only do it in my LJ - I wouldn't go to someone else's and harsh their buzz.
I mean, if I have an opinion, I want to express it, but there is no need to go pour cold water in the fans .
The only other exception is BOF but that is because up until the end I loved some parts of it - so I'd complain about ones I didn't care for and gush about the ones I loved. By the end though, I was more of a BOF fandom fan (have you ever read hilarious fake LJs of BOF characters?) than the fan of BOF itself :)
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:03 am (UTC)But I did only do it in my LJ - I wouldn't go to someone else's and harsh their buzz.
Yup. Yup. I don't have a problem if people rant at their blogs/journals/whatever. Unless that's all they do. I had to defriend someone a while back, because every week they posted several posts about how much they hated a certain drama. I was cool that they hated it, I wasn't a fan myself. But, all that hate, all that space on my f-list, all that ranting - it got old. I just had to cut the person, because thirteen posts a week about a drama you hate? Posts filled with rants about the drama, actors, and fans. . . yeah, that's a bit much.
The only other exception is BOF but that is because up until the end I loved some parts of it - so I'd complain about ones I didn't care for and gush about the ones I loved.
I was like that with Giant. Once or twice a week, I'd say my peace. At my journal, because that Soompi thread was just crazy.
(have you ever read hilarious fake LJs of BOF characters?)
I have not! But, I'd love to.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:12 am (UTC)http://fringe-charming.livejournal.com/
http://pancake-prince.livejournal.com/
http://pimp-prince.livejournal.com/
http://royalest-prick.livejournal.com/
http://willpotforlove.livejournal.com/
http://wonder-lawn.livejournal.com/
Yes, YAB wasn't my thing but it wasn't the worst thing ever. Insane fandom though.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:16 am (UTC)YAB, at the end of the day, was a fun little piece of crack. The cast had some nice chemistry - because they are all around the same age. And, some of the pop culture stuff was cute. But, it wasn't the best thing ever, as that fandom would have to believe.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:21 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:25 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 03:48 am (UTC)This is one of my rules too. I hate when people rain on my parade. I mean, sure, comment and disagree, I like a debate as much as anyone. But I've literally had people say "I'm so glad (X) got canceled" on an entry where I TALK ABOUT HOW MUCH I LOVE IT. Wtf???
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 04:10 am (UTC)I've had people comment on my posts which were basically "I love such and such actress" by enumerating how much she sucks. Repeatedly. WTF.
no subject
Date: 2010-12-17 04:26 am (UTC)